shadowind

one of the reasons i think knowing somthing absolutely isn't really possible, its filtered through a reference point. the possiblity of a flaw in the data-copy is possible, potentially all data copys are flawed,

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remember "for mere impulse of appetite is slavery, while obedience to a law which we prescirbe to oursleves is liberty"-rousseau: the concept of the general will "if we can not reconcile all opions, then let us endeavour to unite all hearts."-?"to be is to be perceived"-? "‘We can be as honest as we are ignorant. If we are, when asked what is beyond the horizon of the known, we must say that we do not know’-Robert G. Ingersoll

to_hobbes

Yes. In fact, I think all data copies are flawed. Any copy of anything is actually nothing more than an approximation.

Without going into too much detail, it has to do with Heisenberg's uncertainty principle. The more precisely you know the state of an object now, the less precisely you know it's future state. If you were to make a "perfect" data copy of an object in your mind, you would have to take it apart to learn about it's complete structure, thus destroying the object, thus making your copy imperfect. Or your copy can be an imperfect approximation that leaves the object intact.

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(By the way, it's all in your head.)

shadowind

interesting, do you care if i use your tea cup thing in another forum?

also, if our Idea of reality is flawed, could it be flawed in such a way that it is an uncousious part of ourself while apearing otherwise?

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remember "for mere impulse of appetite is slavery, while obedience to a law which we prescirbe to oursleves is liberty"-rousseau: the concept of the general will "if we can not reconcile all opions, then let us endeavour to unite all hearts."-?"to be is to be perceived"-? "‘We can be as honest as we are ignorant. If we are, when asked what is beyond the horizon of the known, we must say that we do not know’-Robert G. Ingersoll

to_hobbes

Of course, go ahead. But chances are it's not exactly my idea. As far as I know, I thought of it, but would bet that someone else has already thought of this idea, published it, and given it a name.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by this. You mean, our ideas are what makes us ourselves, and therefore we don't realize we are flawed? If that's what you mean, I would agree, and not just unconsciously, but our entire mind is made of ideas in this way.

That's not to say, as a Christian might put it, that we are naturally sinful but could never realize it. Its more like uncertainty and imperfect ideas are so much a part of us that we can't even really comprehend it. We can only "know" that our view of the world is imperfect, and we can tell ourselves that we are imperfect intellectually, while not really understanding the implications of that.

But I think this realization is, in a way, the foundation of agnosticism. We can't "know" the universe perfectly, so we can't ever make any absolute claims.

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(By the way, it's all in your head.)

Drizzling Blur

Got to read this thread again, really nice thread idea.

to_hobbes

I'm very glad to hear you liked it!

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(By the way, it's all in your head.)