GI

Exist - something that a human can detect as ‘being’ in some way. Could be matter (gas, liquid, solid) and take up physical mass or non-matter (love, light, hate, dreams, thoughts, beliefs, actions, movements etc) Does a human exist? With respect to the above definition, yes…..but why is it an important question? The important question is ‘what do we know?’, the answer: only what we know and we have not the ability to claim we know (or can know) everything. Is there a God? Well, define God to yourself and we will have a go at answering that, but it can only be a ‘go’. For someone to say ‘no there isn’t a God’, means they do not have the ability to detect one according to their definition, beliefs, senses, perception and understandings. There is certainly no publically known physical evidence of a personal, omnipresent God as defined in organised religion, but one could claim that all the natural laws of the universe are evidence of design by some kind of higher force. Indeed, I would personally claim that life came into being by natural laws and not natural selection – a Platonic conception of form if you will.

AB517

First let me applaud for your effort here.

Before I start questioning you I need to know what you mean by “detecting”.

My definition not only includes direct and indirect evidence but also theoretical possibilities. In science we use the language of mathematics to describe these theoretical possibilities. Math, like many languages, is subject to the author’s perspective but unlike the written language, mathematics lowers the number of possibilities in twisting what we think as real. It helps us from having to address the less likely perspectives that one has to deal with in the written language. When some reports 2+2=5, we can just move quickly past them, in the written language we have to waist time in philosophical babble that get no where if the people are not open minded.

Also what do you mean in the last sentence?
I may be just misunderstanding here. To me natural selection works by/with the natural laws.

GI

Thanks for your response.

>>>>>>>Before I start questioning you I need to know what you mean by “detecting”.

Perceive may have been a better choice of word, but I wasn't sure that was the correct word because something could be perceived by a different organism, not by ourselves, but maybe we could perceive their perception and thus detect its existence!?? Some logic in there somewhere:

>>so what do you mean in the last sentence?
I may be just misunderstanding here. To me natural selection works by/with the natural laws.

I would refer you to the following as natural selection is becoming a very unsatisfactory explanation for the mechanism by which life forms evolved. Natural law does suggest 'design' and thus a supreme force I guess;

http://www.ingentaconnect.com/conten...00003/art03128

__________________
The more you know, the more you realize you don't know, the less you know the more you THINK you know.

shadowind

of course natural selection is bounded by the rules of physics. natural selection could be said to be a natural law no?

__________________
remember "for mere impulse of appetite is slavery, while obedience to a law which we prescirbe to oursleves is liberty"-rousseau: the concept of the general will "if we can not reconcile all opions, then let us endeavour to unite all hearts."-?"to be is to be perceived"-? "‘We can be as honest as we are ignorant. If we are, when asked what is beyond the horizon of the known, we must say that we do not know’-Robert G. Ingersoll

aljo1

I think that God is a force in the universe..the same force that might have created it through the Big Bang! It´s really hard to define God in any term, because we don´t have any proof that He exists or not..all we have is our faith..we believe that He exists. At the sme time we can not proof that He exists. If there´s any form of invisible life after death or sipritual life, then he exists..but can any of this be proven by science in the near future.
Maybe it´s one of those mysteries that no one will solve and we will always have that question. If He really doesnt exist don´t you guys wish He would?

Mustainez

How do we know we exist? How do you know we aren't lying in some hospital as human expiriments and the world around us is our imagination? We don't. How do we know there is a God? We don't. We can hope there is an afterlife, some period of enlightenment, that secrets will be reavealed.

shadowind

no.

__________________
remember "for mere impulse of appetite is slavery, while obedience to a law which we prescirbe to oursleves is liberty"-rousseau: the concept of the general will "if we can not reconcile all opions, then let us endeavour to unite all hearts."-?"to be is to be perceived"-? "‘We can be as honest as we are ignorant. If we are, when asked what is beyond the horizon of the known, we must say that we do not know’-Robert G. Ingersoll

Skepticologist

Maybe, but it depends on which god depicted in christian scripture, which I assume is your reference point, you're alluding to. If it's the one who loves all his created humans as his children and wants them all to live with him eternally in heaven, then I wish he did exist.

But if it's the one who created humans with the innate propensity to piss him off and make him jealous, and who will punish them with unquenchable fire and torment for eternity, I think I'll pass.

__________________
"I am an agnostic; I do not pretend to know what many ignorant men are sure of."

Clarence Darrow

GX

Mustainez
You are asking very good questions and I must say I am quite amazed and impressed at the level of inquisitiveness and knowledge at your age to ask such questions and ponder such thoughts. The afterlife and God questions may take a little while to sort themselves out and do keep searching and asking questions but do not let your search consume you and your time! I highly recommend a balanced lifestyle. In the meantime, I highly recommend you also devote an equal amount of time and just as much passion and energy to figuring out the girls around you and what makes them laugh and smile! Its usually the same things that make you laugh and smile (you know, stupid teachers and so on). You will find much more fulfilling and immediate rewards in those pursuits!

Mustainez

Thanks GX!