The Fall of Man - Page 2

romansh · 01-04-2008, 09:08 PM

Reading over the hols

Adam and Eve got kicked out of Eden for disobeying god and 'getting' the knowledge of good and evil.

To get back into Eden, we, man, anybody who wants to, have (has) to unlearn that particular bit of knowledge.

Simple really?

the author
Joseph Campbell......... Pathways to Bliss

nkrummy · 01-08-2008, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skepticologist

If there was a fall of man, which I seriously doubt, it was brought about by the propensities with which god (whom I seriously doubt, at least in a christian context) created him.

It's like a supreme being, who is referred to as god, brought inferior beings, referred to as humans, into existence with a predisposition to behave in ways he deplored. And when they behaved in ways consistent with how he created them, he banished them from the garden and, even worse, under the christian dispensation, sentenced them to an eternity of untold torment.

The christian response to such an assertion involves free will, i.e. god set you up to fail, but you can still choose to succeed against overwhelming odds, if only you summon the will, from somewhere within your god-induced depraved self, to do so.

I think this covers it pretty well- great post!

Of course, the other part to this is where God even places the forbidden tree in the garden and plants a snake there to entice Adam and Eve into disobeying him. Apparantly the "fall of man" was this God's intention all along.

Katnip89 · 01-11-2008, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Mankind realized that he could kill himself - that he could make himself die - but that in the end, he could not make himself live. This began an unending conflict between God (instinct) and our objective knowledge of existence. I think that this is the reason for so much of the struggle between human beings. Am I making any sense???

I think you are way ahead of the game, honestly. I'd recommend watching Monty Python's, The Life of Brian. It's not only hillarious, but it has a feeling of realism and agnosticism(sp) through the whole movie. The main statement is basically: as Brian quotes, " You don't need anyone!! We have the power to control our own lives. Who says we MUST listen to a messiah? Think for YOUR -SELVES!" and then the crowd replies " Yes, we must think for ourselves" and it shows the stupidity, or as you put it , the fall of man.

I believe the fall of man would be: People depending on others instead of believing in themselves, and having confidence that , however hard it may seem, the mass majority of people are RETARDED. Sorry if I seem to rabble on forever , but your topic really struck a cord with me. I just hope that some day people won't have to ask a mass majority of people how to live their own lives.

AB517 · 01-14-2008, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Katnip89

Quote:

Mankind realized that he could kill himself - that he could make himself die - but that in the end, he could not make himself live. This began an unending conflict between God (instinct) and our objective knowledge of existence. I think that this is the reason for so much of the struggle between human beings. Am I making any sense???

I think you are way ahead of the game, honestly. I'd recommend watching Monty Python's, The Life of Brian. It's not only hillarious, but it has a feeling of realism and agnosticism(sp) through the whole movie. The main statement is basically: as Brian quotes, " You don't need anyone!! We have the power to control our own lives. Who says we MUST listen to a messiah? Think for YOUR -SELVES!" and then the crowd replies " Yes, we must think for ourselves" and it shows the stupidity, or as you put it , the fall of man.

I believe the fall of man would be: People depending on others instead of believing in themselves, and having confidence that , however hard it may seem, the mass majority of people are RETARDED. Sorry if I seem to rabble on forever , but your topic really struck a cord with me. I just hope that some day people won't have to ask a mass majority of people how to live their own lives.

If every brick did what it wanted ... we would have no buildings.

Nobody can fool me like myself.

When people stop asking others to teach them ... growth will stop.

romansh · 01-19-2008, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AB517

If every brick did what it wanted ... we would have no buildings.

Is this actually true?
Or do we just have a low opinion of bricks?

cheeta52 · 01-19-2008, 08:44 PM

I have looked into this... In the bible god is said to Omnipotent. This is classically defined as the ability to see all hear all basically do anything and most importantly see into the future... If that one man can see into our direct and perpetual future then what of free will? There would be none thus the fall of man is of gods invention.

Geshtinnanna · 01-20-2008, 03:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cheeta52

I have looked into this... In the bible god is said to Omnipotent. This is classically defined as the ability to see all hear all basically do anything and most importantly see into the future... If that one man can see into our direct and perpetual future then what of free will? There would be none thus the fall of man is of gods invention.

What one man?