greywolf90

"useless drevil" i think that last comment was uncalled for. if you ask someone a question, don't blame them for answering it. as for me, i think that the supernatural does exist, and it is just beyond our currant understanding. i have studied the human anatomy and how we function, and i agree that we were created by something. what that "something" is depends on each person's philosophy. i don't believe in a particular religion because, while each belief has usefull knowledge and ideas, i do not think that any religion is the true one. i see religion as something man made and not divine. also, every religion that i know of has the flaw of intolerence leading to fighting and violence. this is why i base my beliefes on my own perception of life. i may not agree with christianity, but if that is what makes you happy and makes your life better, then good for you. i think religion is generally good as long as the people are good. if the people are bad (terrorists of all religions) then it makes religion not so good.

Gettin' In Tune

I find this remark discriminatory.

Perhaps I should let you know where I am coming. I have grown intolerant of people forming a binary judicial systems contigent on baseless claims.

I have no idea what you are talking about. Are you claiming that people will avoid madness if they resort to illogical thought and behavior?

Anyways, welcome to the forum. Don't let my remarks be a hinderance in your participation. As you can see people do not share my views.

__________________
"But to find the truth we need imagination and skepticism both. We will not be afraid to speculate, but we will be careful to distinguish speculation from fact."--C.Sagan

Gettin' In Tune

Please enlighten me on how this infraction system works, especially when you have an anti-semitic moderator. It is quite confusing.

__________________
"But to find the truth we need imagination and skepticism both. We will not be afraid to speculate, but we will be careful to distinguish speculation from fact."--C.Sagan

Gaius

I would be glad to explore the base of my views with you. But I need a particular objection to work with rather than a "baseless" its baseless charge. I have hundreds of reasons that I am a Christian. You'll find them out. So once I become Christian the conclusion easily follows from that base.

No what I am saying is that it is illogical to resort solely to logic. Logic has its obvious place and is an indespensible tool but simplicity is even more beautiful. And the best things about our magical existence cannot and should not be rationalized (at least not to illogical degrees lest you become a debunker of humanism, the next step after that usually involves the wondering if we even exist in the first place). Art and love fall in this category.

And thanks for the welcome. Btw I have nothing against early Floyd, I just like the post Barrett stuff better.

George

Infractions are given when a member in our community violates one or more of the rules and guidelines listed here. Please see section 1 item #2 for your specific violation.

Infractions add points to your user profile and after you reach 20 points you are automatically banned. Whether or not the ban is permanent is at the discretion of the moderator or administrator who issued it.

The good news is that infractions are normally temporary. The points can expire within 30 to 90 days so you can potentially have enough infraction points without being banned so long as you are not a repeat offender within a 30 to 90 day period.

PLEASE NOTE: I often try to rationalize NOT giving infractions as much as possible, as the last thing we want is for our community to become a dictatorship. However, do realize that this is an agnostic forum and you should not expect everyone to agree with your position as a believer. Even the staff.... We are members of the community just like you. We volunteer our time to ensure the community is a great place for everyone to voice their views and not be attacked personally because of it.

So, for people looking to discuss their views, ideology, and theory in a place where not everyone is the same as you and will therefore provide a more objective discussion, this is the place!

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Gaius

I dont blame you. Pogo stick is a blast. Very underated. Actually recent research suggests that jumping on a trampoline may stimulate the lymphatic system and increase metabolism. I wonder if the same logic could be applied to poggoing?

Gettin' In Tune

Gaius,

I owe you an apology for last night. I was a little tipsy and spewing less than rational thoughts onto the board. Please feel welcome here.

I do not appreciate, comprehend, nor think a binary judicial system is enlightening. The Bible is the only base of reference for heaven and hell. That is why I say it is baseless; it lacks credentials. Granted the Bible is a metaphysical book, but one can find many baseless statements in the Bible and to believe they are true requires a huge leap of faith. Many ardent Christians believe that the only way through the gates of heaven is to take Jesus into your heart.

Logic can be very simple and beautiful. I do not fully understand you.

I find life filled with mystery, beauty, and wonder. There are a lot of unknowns out there. If we strive to increase our knowledge about our world and the universe in must be done logically.

Art and love can be subjective. Love is a natural feeling that can be explained rationally. Many people (atheists included) prefer a poetic and romantic explanation of love over a rational explanation. That is nothing wrong with this.

You have a lot to choose from. Barret only produced one record with Pink Floyd; their initial record called The Piper at the Gates of Dawn.

Momentary Lapse of Reason is a nice post Waters Album.

__________________
"But to find the truth we need imagination and skepticism both. We will not be afraid to speculate, but we will be careful to distinguish speculation from fact."--C.Sagan

Gaius

Oh its cool man. Not a big deal at all. Forget it.

Yes it can be. But I'm speaking of its converse. One can get so deep as to begin to question anything...even their own existence. Which, what I'm saying, ironically enough is illogical. Lets forget this though becuase were not on the same page here and I dont think it really matters a whole lot.

I agree fully. But I think its important to remember that we can never figure out how the universe got here in the first place or why it goes on as it does in a scientific sense. Everything we observe is post big-bang. Now what caused this bang will always be a mystery in the scientific sense. Also the recent discoveries involving quantum physics has assured us that all we can do is predict the outcome of certain events and that complete knowledge is indeed unnattainable. What I'm saying here is not (right now) part of any particular argument of mine its just something to keep in mind.

Yes it is the PRIMARY base of reference for Heaven and Hell. And not so much in the Old Testament as in the New. Christ primarily taught the doctorines. So belief in them hinges on ones belief in His ressurection as the validation of His divnic claims. The evidence for which I will be disscussing in great length in various posts in here.

I must have accidentily erased your post on love. I was gonna reply but dont have it now...oh well.

Gaius

Its also important to remember that not all Christians are exclusivists. It is said that no man goes to Heaven but through Christ. This could mean a number of things. Could not a person who has never even heard of Christ "converse" with Him after death? Then subsequently be judged by his character? The rabbit hole can go very deep on this one.

Of the church fathers of history who have been exclusivists their general philosophy was that man is so depraved and debased that God in a last ditch effort has attempted to save as many of us as possible and that in some way that we cannot of course fully comprehend we need to believe in Christ in order to atone. This is not my personnal stance but it is that of some of the faith who think such things through.

Gettin' In Tune

I would not say never. We already know how the cosmos operates in a scientific sense. We do not know how it fully operates, but increasing our scientific understanding of the cosmos is significant.

Your claim is unjustified. It is currently unfathomable, but it might not remain that way.

Could you expand on this thought.

I agree, but why plug God into the gap of knowledge? That is not keeping an open mind.

__________________
"But to find the truth we need imagination and skepticism both. We will not be afraid to speculate, but we will be careful to distinguish speculation from fact."--C.Sagan