Interbeing - Page 2

harleylove · 07-18-2007, 05:28 PM

Og, I've been reading Myths of Light since yesterday. I think I have about 30 pages left. It is a really good book and when you compare the eastern philosophies and western philosophies, wow what a difference. I think I'm going to research taosim a liitle further. Sure has opened my eyes up to Christianity too. Thanks for the recommendation.

Og · 07-18-2007, 06:12 PM

glad you enjoyed it. I think that Joseph Campbell is THE most important author and humanities scholar of the last 50 years.

Og · 07-18-2007, 08:57 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXmdKWVirUA

Part of a series that I just started watching. I'm 6 minutes into it and the host describes the interbeing of the table he's sitting on while talking about the framework of the 4 noble truths of buddhism. He's introducing us to lectures by the dalai lama on the 4 noble truths.

harleylove · 07-18-2007, 09:05 PM

Thanks for the link. I just started watching it, too.

Og · 07-18-2007, 09:08 PM

This video looks pretty good actually. Dalai lama delivers the spirituality of buddhism in terms of the interdependent nature of all things and in terms of nonviolence.

Og · 07-18-2007, 09:11 PM

Harleylove, what did you think of campbell's expression of the kundalini yoga path? I thought it was totally cool that the ultimate experience of the hindu spiritual path is to realize your identity with the divine and with all things. Every single hindu strives to become identical with christ and god (in terms of western forms).

Over here, that gets you crucified.

harleylove · 07-18-2007, 09:55 PM

The spirituality is amazing, I really liked the aum too. For some reason I related to that and to believe that heaven and God is in us how empowering is that. I really enjoyed all the stories too and it helps that Campbell has a sense of humor, I guess you need to when comparing the eastern and western forms because the western just looks silly.

As far as the Dalai Lama, thank goodness for translators

, I had my head up against the speakers trying to understand him. He's got a sense of humor, kinda surprised me.

Thanks again for the link.

Og · 07-19-2007, 06:54 AM

Pratitya-samutpada

Dependent Origination

Quote:

Stated in another way, everything depends on everything else. For example, a human being's existence in any given moment is dependent on the condition of everything else in the world (and indeed the universe) at that moment but, conversely, the condition of everything in the world in that moment depend in an equally significant way on the character and condition of that human being. Everything in the universe is interconnected through the web of cause and effect so that the whole and the parts are mutually interdependent. The character and condition of entities at any given time are intimately connected with the character and condition of all other entities that superficially may appear to be unconnected or unrelated.

Because all things are thus conditioned and transient (anicca), they have no real independent identity (anatta) so do not truly ‘exist’, though to ordinary minds this appears to be the case. all phenomena are therefore fundamentally insubstantial and ‘empty’ (sunya).

Wise human beings, who ‘see things as they are’ (yatha-bhuta-ñana-dassana), renounce attachment and clinging, transform the energy of desire into awareness and understanding, and eventually transcend the conditioned realm of form becoming Buddhas or Arhats.

This is the realization I came to on my own and then found buddhism. All of the mathematics of engineering and physics speak of phenomena in these terms. I started down this path the first time I recorded from a neuron in a living organism and heard the spikes in response to me probing part of the physical body of the animal. That really drove home the physical nature of being... And that that neuron's spikes were caused by me poking the animal. Then that my poking the animal was caused by my curiosity which was a product of my upbringing.

None of it truly exists with independent identity.

The bold line above is the same as me saying "free will and self are myths"

Og · 07-19-2007, 07:29 AM

The dichotomy of pairs of opposites (life/death, good/evil, left/right, fear/desire, being/nonbeing) are all things that fragment the world into boundaries and barriers. Distinctions like this are the cause of suffering.

The pyramid on the dollar bill is an expression of this idea. On any side of the pyramid, there is an opposite side. The only place that this is not true is at the apex and that is where the eye of the divine is.

The garden of eden story (and the associated story in eastern myth of aham) speaks to this. DUALITY.. good and evil (the fruit of the tree) are what cast us out of paradise. Two cherubs with one sword (more dichotomies) guard the gate to eden. The story of christ is for you to not be pulled to and fro by the concept of these dualities... "Love your enemies, hate your friends" These are teachings of the middle way that transcends categories of thought.

This is the central notion in all religious philosophies. This is the one true religion of humanity. The elementary idea that makes us human.

The point is not renunciation or attachment... The point is to not cling and to just be at an immovable spot (you will see many buddha statues with his hand touching the ground indicating he will not be moved by fear/desire). The whole world broiling around you and it has no effect on you.

THIS IS THE MEANING OF THE END OF THE WORLD. This is Jesus' teachings. When you no longer are cast about by fears and desires of the world then you have transcended that. The "end of the world" is not some physical event.. that doesn't make any sense... it is a psychological realization. A transcendence of categories of thought.

harleylove · 07-19-2007, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Og

The dichotomy of pairs of opposites (life/death, good/evil, left/right, fear/desire, being/nonbeing) are all things that fragment the world into boundaries and barriers. Distinctions like this are the cause of suffering. [

I understand this but....

How about the logic that you can't have happiness until you experience suffering, can't appreciate what you have until you do without etc.

Quote:

The pyramid on the dollar bill is an expression of this idea. On any side of the pyramid, there is an opposite side. The only place that this is not true is at the apex and that is where the eye of the divine is.

Where did this come from? meaning, how did we get from that meaning to the one we practice now

Quote:

The point is not renunciation or attachment... The point is to not cling and to just be at an immovable spot (you will see many buddha statues with his hand touching the ground indicating he will not be moved by fear/desire). The whole world broiling around you and it has no effect on you.

But isn't this kind of void? Buddhism in a way seems so unfeeling to me. Can you clarify for me a little bit more

Quote:

THIS IS THE MEANING OF THE END OF THE WORLD. This is Jesus' teachings. When you no longer are cast about by fears and desires of the world then you have transcended that. The "end of the world" is not some physical event.. that doesn't make any sense... it is a psychological realization. A transcendence of categories of thought.

For some reason I ask myself what is left after you remove fear and desire?

I'm just hoping you can explain a little better. I understand the logic behind it and nirvana but I know I'm missing something here. You may be one with the Universe(God) and everything around you but I keep picturing all that is left is a shell with no identity.

Sorry to pick you apart