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Ideology, Theology, & Mythology Arguments for and against certain ideological stances regarding or regardless of their literal/factual validity.



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Old 12-29-2006, 01:05 PM   #1 (permalink)
DizzyDee
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Default 10 Myths & 10 Truths Re: Atheism

Although I do not consider myself an Atheist, I am certainly an Atheist-leaning agnostic - if that makes sense. I find that there are a lot of misunderstandings about people who do not believe in God or are not sure if God exists, and I thought this article was interesting. I thought I would share it with all of you, whether agnostic, christian, believer, non-believer, athiest, secular humanist, whatever. I think it's a great article to promote understanding.

From 10 myths -- and 10 truths -- about atheism - Los Angeles Times

10 Myths & 10 Truths about Atheism

1) Atheists believe that life is meaningless.

On the contrary, religious people often worry that life is meaningless and imagine that it can only be redeemed by the promise of eternal happiness beyond the grave. Atheists tend to be quite sure that life is precious. Life is imbued with meaning by being really and fully lived. Our relationships with those we love are meaningful now; they need not last forever to be made so. Atheists tend to find this fear of meaninglessness … well … meaningless.

2) Atheism is responsible for the greatest crimes in human history.

People of faith often claim that the crimes of Hitler, Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot were the inevitable product of unbelief. The problem with fascism and communism, however, is not that they are too critical of religion; the problem is that they are too much like religions. Such regimes are dogmatic to the core and generally give rise to personality cults that are indistinguishable from cults of religious hero worship. Auschwitz, the gulag and the killing fields were not examples of what happens when human beings reject religious dogma; they are examples of political, racial and nationalistic dogma run amok. There is no society in human history that ever suffered because its people became too reasonable.

3) Atheism is dogmatic.

Jews, Christians and Muslims claim that their scriptures are so prescient of humanity's needs that they could only have been written under the direction of an omniscient deity. An atheist is simply a person who has considered this claim, read the books and found the claim to be ridiculous. One doesn't have to take anything on faith, or be otherwise dogmatic, to reject unjustified religious beliefs. As the historian Stephen Henry Roberts (1901-71) once said: "I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours."

4) Atheists think everything in the universe arose by chance.

No one knows why the universe came into being. In fact, it is not entirely clear that we can coherently speak about the "beginning" or "creation" of the universe at all, as these ideas invoke the concept of time, and here we are talking about the origin of space-time itself.

The notion that atheists believe that everything was created by chance is also regularly thrown up as a criticism of Darwinian evolution. As Richard Dawkins explains in his marvelous book, "The God Delusion," this represents an utter misunderstanding of evolutionary theory. Although we don't know precisely how the Earth's early chemistry begat biology, we know that the diversity and complexity we see in the living world is not a product of mere chance. Evolution is a combination of chance mutation and natural selection. Darwin arrived at the phrase "natural selection" by analogy to the "artificial selection" performed by breeders of livestock. In both cases, selection exerts a highly non-random effect on the development of any species.

5) Atheism has no connection to science.

Although it is possible to be a scientist and still believe in God — as some scientists seem to manage it — there is no question that an engagement with scientific thinking tends to erode, rather than support, religious faith. Taking the U.S. population as an example: Most polls show that about 90% of the general public believes in a personal God; yet 93% of the members of the National Academy of Sciences do not. This suggests that there are few modes of thinking less congenial to religious faith than science is.

6) Atheists are arrogant.

When scientists don't know something — like why the universe came into being or how the first self-replicating molecules formed — they admit it. Pretending to know things one doesn't know is a profound liability in science. And yet it is the life-blood of faith-based religion. One of the monumental ironies of religious discourse can be found in the frequency with which people of faith praise themselves for their humility, while claiming to know facts about cosmology, chemistry and biology that no scientist knows. When considering questions about the nature of the cosmos and our place within it, atheists tend to draw their opinions from science. This isn't arrogance; it is intellectual honesty.

7) Atheists are closed to spiritual experience.

There is nothing that prevents an atheist from experiencing love, ecstasy, rapture and awe; atheists can value these experiences and seek them regularly. What atheists don't tend to do is make unjustified (and unjustifiable) claims about the nature of reality on the basis of such experiences. There is no question that some Christians have transformed their lives for the better by reading the Bible and praying to Jesus. What does this prove? It proves that certain disciplines of attention and codes of conduct can have a profound effect upon the human mind. Do the positive experiences of Christians suggest that Jesus is the sole savior of humanity? Not even remotely — because Hindus, Buddhists, Muslims and even atheists regularly have similar experiences.

There is, in fact, not a Christian on this Earth who can be certain that Jesus even wore a beard, much less that he was born of a virgin or rose from the dead. These are just not the sort of claims that spiritual experience can authenticate.

8) Atheists believe that there is nothing beyond human life and human understanding.

Atheists are free to admit the limits of human understanding in a way that religious people are not. It is obvious that we do not fully understand the universe; but it is even more obvious that neither the Bible nor the Koran reflects our best understanding of it. We do not know whether there is complex life elsewhere in the cosmos, but there might be. If there is, such beings could have developed an understanding of nature's laws that vastly exceeds our own. Atheists can freely entertain such possibilities. They also can admit that if brilliant extraterrestrials exist, the contents of the Bible and the Koran will be even less impressive to them than they are to human atheists.

From the atheist point of view, the world's religions utterly trivialize the real beauty and immensity of the universe. One doesn't have to accept anything on insufficient evidence to make such an observation.

9) Atheists ignore the fact that religion is extremely beneficial to society.

Those who emphasize the good effects of religion never seem to realize that such effects fail to demonstrate the truth of any religious doctrine. This is why we have terms such as "wishful thinking" and "self-deception." There is a profound distinction between a consoling delusion and the truth.

In any case, the good effects of religion can surely be disputed. In most cases, it seems that religion gives people bad reasons to behave well, when good reasons are actually available. Ask yourself, which is more moral, helping the poor out of concern for their suffering, or doing so because you think the creator of the universe wants you to do it, will reward you for doing it or will punish you for not doing it?

10) Atheism provides no basis for morality.

If a person doesn't already understand that cruelty is wrong, he won't discover this by reading the Bible or the Koran — as these books are bursting with celebrations of cruelty, both human and divine. We do not get our morality from religion. We decide what is good in our good books by recourse to moral intuitions that are (at some level) hard-wired in us and that have been refined by thousands of years of thinking about the causes and possibilities of human happiness.

We have made considerable moral progress over the years, and we didn't make this progress by reading the Bible or the Koran more closely. Both books condone the practice of slavery — and yet every civilized human being now recognizes that slavery is an abomination. Whatever is good in scripture — like the golden rule — can be valued for its ethical wisdom without our believing that it was handed down to us by the creator of the universe.
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Old 12-30-2006, 10:19 AM   #2 (permalink)
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That is a very well written article. As an Atheist, I'd love to hand that out to those who misunderstand my beliefs. As for #6, I'm not arrogant because I'm Atheist, that just happens to be a coincidence.

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Old 12-30-2006, 01:17 PM   #3 (permalink)
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That was a very interesting read. Thanks for sharing.
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Old 12-31-2006, 11:27 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Cute GloryB - and arrogance is certainly not resisted to atheism. I've know some arrogant mormons, christians, JW's, buddhists, atheists, and agnostics - just as I've known humble versions of all the above.

I really liked the last point about how reading the bible or koran will not make an immoral person morale - and that many people look for examples in the Bible and Koran that promote natural human compassion and disregard the ugliness therein.
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Old 01-12-2007, 08:50 AM   #5 (permalink)
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I didn't necessarily believe any of the myths you listed, but I still don't understand atheism.
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Old 01-12-2007, 09:55 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyricb View Post
I didn't necessarily believe any of the myths you listed, but I still don't understand atheism.
Is there something specific you don't understand? Are there any questions you have? You're in the right place to ask.
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Old 01-12-2007, 08:32 PM   #7 (permalink)
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What's funny is I know atheists that fit every one of those "myths".

I can name 2 I see on a weekly basis that believe life is meaningless.

You can't ever generalize any one group like that as if you know what you're talking about. Only people who believe in God would think any person or thing had the power to know the thoughts of any whole group of people.
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Old 01-13-2007, 04:04 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Sam Harris wrote the above editorial article and is from:
Edge

He is a contemporary of Daniel Dennett at that organization
Daniel Dennett - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Dennett is an american philosopher who writes about the evolution of free will and it as myth as my conversation over in the creation vs evolution forum covers.

What's great about science's illustration of free will as myth based on moder neuroscience and mathematics associated with complex systems is that this is the silver bullet that science has for modern litaralist religion (pretty much all of them).

By illustrating through empirical and repeatable means that free will is myth (a construct which guides the evolution of our society) you can take all of these exclusive literal and personal god religions and hoist them by their own petard. It's no longer a question of if their undisprovable/unprovable god exists. It's an illustration of how if free will is ultimately a human construct than these religions, which rely so heavily on free will, are myth as well!

I mean, how can heaven/hell be real if you aren't really in control since free will is only mental construct. It's the ultimate empirical evidence to debunk literal religion!

I feel like I have a frickin excalibur in my hands with this realization and I want to go start fighting with it.. I just don't even know where to begin!

This realization places an empirical approach as the only viable one. It completely changes concepts of government and self and of our connection to nature. It's so awesome! And it's all precisely what modern science demonstrates!

It's the ultimate illustration of where our society must go forward into.
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Old 01-24-2007, 04:12 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
2) Atheism is responsible for the greatest crimes in human history
...
Quote:
There is no society in human history that ever suffered because its people became too reasonable.
Exactly, you can be an unreasonable atheist, the fact that you don't believe in god, doesn't mean that you are reasonable. there were nazi and Stalinist atheists etc.

It seems to me that being a 'critical thinker' is more basic than being an atheist of agnostic as far as being reasonable goes.
The problem is that some people declare that 'I am an atheist, therefore I am reasonable' which they certainly aren't.

Quote:
5)Atheism has no connection to science
...
Quote:
Most polls show that about 90% of the general public believes in a personal God
Wait, atheists don't believe in any god. there is a difference between an existence of some supernatural deity, of which we may know very little, and between a specific deity (personal, biblical, quranic etc.).

Quote:
8) Atheists believe that there is nothing beyond human life and human understanding.
Actually you didn't answer whether they believe in life after death, or not (actually the answer might suggest that they are 'agnostic' regarding that question...)

Quote:
9) Atheists ignore the fact that religion is extremely beneficial to society
...
Quote:
Those who emphasize the good effects of religion never seem to realize that such effects fail to demonstrate the truth of any religious doctrine
Actually the argument is not for the veracity of religion (which will make it 'an argument from implication') but an argument for atheists to keep their big mouth shut - sort of a white lie we tell ourselves so society might continue to exist). (I am not making that argument, I'm just stating it)

Quote:
10) Atheism provides no basis for morality.

If a person doesn't already understand that cruelty is wrong, he won't
first, Children intimate the fact that something is wrong by us telling them so.
also, there are many things that are not so clear cut: something you may think is wrong and another person might not. In that case a decision will be made not because it is moral but because the majority or the stronger side can enforce it.
I do tend to agree that atheism converts the word 'moral' to the word 'convention'.
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