Abel

Let's put things in proper order. I did not assault X. And, my question to him regarding his authority was in his statements regarding Jesus (such as Jesus was a yogi), and his view that he knew the real meanings of Christ's teachings. I wanted to know his source for making these statements. I never questioned that his beliefs were not a result of faith. He obviously has faith in something. I merely wanted to know his well that he drew from.

I may disagree with someone of another faith or belief, but I will have more respect for them if they have something upon which to base their beliefs, other than "Because I think so."

You may not agree with my interpretation and application of the scriptures, but at least I do have something to interpret and apply.

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God loves you and I'm trying.

duck

This is a funny thread. I am amused.

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Religion: The ultimate definition of verisimilitude

GX

The ole 20 million frenchmen cant be wrong argument. Well, millions of germans held nazism to be sacrosanct. Millions of Spainiards thought the spanish inquisition was holy etc. This argument doesnt hold water for me Abel. Idea's are better judged on their own merits rather than how many people hold them. If thats how you wish to approach it, of course that is your choice.

X stated his beliefs quite lucidly. I saw no "mystic twists" or deception whatsoever. Og very eloquently explained the origin of those ideas and x did mention some books he read in a previous post and how he got to where he is at now so there is no mystery there. BTW, where does it say an idea has to be written down on parchment somewhere in order for it to be "real"? Ive got news for you, idea's are real whether or not they are written down. God is within everyone one of us. Thats the best place to look IMHO. In these matters, books are at best merely tools, not the be all end all. The heart is where its at, not books.

Ive have already invited God into my heart (actually he never left, my mind just chose to ignore him, but thats the subject of another post), and it was the result of renouncing your particular doctrine, not because of it. You cant deny that God or Jesus is not in my heart any more than I can deny that he is not in your heart on the basis of "beliefs" or "books" alone. Yours is not the only way or a better way but merely another way. Same goes for me and everyone else. Now if we can get all religions to say this, there will be world peace.

I choose to drop it as I have already rejected your beliefs a while back THANKS BE TO GOD. I do commend you for responding though. Just to be clear, my purpose is not to convert you either but to illuminate for others who may be reading this via debate.

PsiCop

The real question, though, is whether or not there actually is any "yonder shore" in the first place. The premise of spirituality, including its manifestation as religion, is that there is some "other world" out there. Yet curiously (or not!), no one has ever substantiated whether or not this "other world" exists.

xexon

I should make something clear. And I apologize for not doing so sooner.

I don't have beliefs. I tell you what I see. The thinking that is involved is one of translation from the visual form that I see it in, to a form that I can type and you can understand. The ego will add flavor, but that can be corrected because I am a living person capable of taking questions.

That's the most simplistic explanation I can offer.

When you ask for evidence of this or that, I can produce a handful of nothing.

But what I can offer you is the concept of seeing as I do. Concepts are a seed. Your name is Jack, and I've given you some magic beans. What will you do next? Eat them for the intellectual knowledge of what they taste like, or plant them, and watch a wonderful cycle unfold?

No amount of wordplay will ever convince anyone of the existance of God. But if someone can experience God, even for an instance, doubt and faith are vaporized by light of direct perception.

It's really how you see normally. Before you got drunk on sensation, fell "down", and forgot your way home.



x

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Destroyer of Worlds

debdodd

you find it funny .... I find it weird .... for neither side "knows" anything for sure ... they can argue in circles but there is no "proof" that I see.

I just know that Abel's God does not exsist ... all the rest is conjecture .... some of it sounds better and perhaps more possible but until we die, I don't think any of us will know ... but I am willing to bet my soul that Abel is wrong ...

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"Ubi dubium ibi libertas."

"We are all lone souls. It pays to know humility, lest the delusion of control, of mastery, overwhelms. And indeed, we seem a species prone to that delusion, again and ever again ....."

xexon

Its not a matter of knowing. Its a matter of seeing for yourself.


x

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Destroyer of Worlds

romansh

Abel .... as casual observer ... you well is not very deep and the clarity of water you are offering is about 500 NTUs (Nephelometric Turbidity Units)

I'd put Xexon at about about 20 or 30 NTUs

I ... know like anyone cares... but I would not recommend your water to anyone.

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There is a theory which states that if ever anybody discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There is another theory which states that this has already happened. ........... Douglas Adams

xexon

I get my water upstream. Before it gets to the lake.

x

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Destroyer of Worlds

duck

You are right in that we just won't know. What I find amusing is that both are arguing the same side of the coin, just from different perspectives.

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Religion: The ultimate definition of verisimilitude