i am a born again, evangelical christian - Page 5

godlovesyou · 11-04-2007, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by girlinterrupted364

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buddha

My first post came off a bit harsh I confess. The Thing that I am against is that you are positive you are right, your betting your soul on it. But from what I see there is no proof what so ever. The only thing you have to base your beliefs on is a book written a couple thoudsand years ago by a buch of guys. I belive that religion was created to keep the masses in line. I think that most people go nuts if they can't have all the answers so they belive in religion. Well I'd rather be nuts than belive that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

this is exactly what i think of every time someone reminds me to repent of my sins. christians are betting their very souls on their personal religion. well guess what? so are buddhists and muslims and every other religion out there. so stop acting like its not possible for any other religion to be correct because honestly, none of them can be proven. you can believe with all your heart that your religion is true. but you cant PROVE it. so stop trying to convince people

i am not here to try to convince anyone here. read my first post.

god cannot be proven, but the evidence is here. how do you think live, and the universe, came to be ?

Derbonic · 11-04-2007, 01:15 PM

A question without an answer does not constitute evidence. THAT is why we are agnostic. We are honest with ourselves about having answers to the big questions.

romansh · 11-04-2007, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by godlovesyou

i am not here to try to convince anyone here. read my first post.

god cannot be proven, but the evidence is here. how do you think live, and the universe, came to be ?

hi godlovesyou

Is this true? In your heart of hearts? Every true Christian is required to spread the word? And if we do not take the word into our hearts then that Christian has been unsuccessful. I do not blame you for trying to spread the word .... I actually expect you to try.

OK god created the world! Why is it a Christian God? A logical/rational answer please?

all the best

**Skepticologist** · 11-04-2007, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by godlovesyou

god cannot be proven, but the evidence is here. how do you think live, and the universe, came to be ?

Some other way, and certainly not the way the bible says it did. There's simply too much scientific evidence to even start believing that.

I thought you'd give us all some examples of how god and jesus work in your life. That's the kind of "evidence" most of the evangelical christians I know offer for their beliefs, and I'm convinced they honestly think there's a cause-and-effect dynamic in operation.

One thing all religious adherents have in common is the "leap of faith". It's a "leap" because a person has to suspend reason and logic in order to make it. And reason and logic don't work in the religious realm because there is no empirical evidence for the existence of god.

After a person has made the "leap" and embraced a certain religious system, there's no end to the reinforcement for his or her belief that's possible. As an example, christians are taught by the bible that god doesn't always give them what they ask for when they pray. But they can count on whatever comes about as the result of their prayers as being what their all-wise and loving god has deemed best for them. So whatever happens after they pray proves to them that god has answered their prayers.

I suppose you think the intestinal fortitude you've displayed in laying out your religious beliefs on this forum will earn you a couple of stars in your crown. But, with regard to those of us who are true agnostics, you're wasting your time. I don't think a meaningful discourse is possible between someone who operates based on reason and logic and someone who operates on faith.

godlovesyou · 11-04-2007, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Astreja

Quote:

Originally Posted by godlovesyou

all created is a strong evidence that god exists.

I disagree. For one thing, we have no credible evidence that it was "created" by a sentient being. Also consider, please, that if there actually is a creating being it could be completely unlike the god described in your Bible.

might you explain how you think the universe came to be, if no creator made it. shure, many religions give answers, of how god might be, but only one is the reality. its up to us, to find it. however, we are very limited beings. So , if there is a creator, he has to reveal himself to us, so that we can know him. Does any creator reveal to humanity. I believe so. The bible cannot be a invention of men. only god knows the future. the bible has made more than 6000 prophecies, of which moreless half fullfilled.

Quote:

life comes only from life. from dead materia, a living organism can never appear.This is not yet established as a fact..

then lets examine the probability, live came to existance by chance.

Mark Ludwig in his book "Computer Viruses, Artificial Life and Evolution" states:

E. Coli is one of the simplest living organisms. As of today the only thing simpler is a virus and they need the inside of a cell to live. E. Coli has a DNA molecule which is about 4,000,000 nucleotides long. Each of these four million sites is occupied by one of four different nucleotides. So, the probability of creating it at random from the right bases is 1 in 44,000,000 = 1 in 103,000,000. Putting every atom in the universe to work synthesizing molecules wouldn't even put a dent in this number. Evolutionists suggest with the redundancy of the genetic code we could shrink this number down to 102,300,000. After this the number may be able to be shrunk more but most scientists believe that the number would also get much bigger as we begin to factor in different types of chemical bonds and isomers of the nucleic acids, all of which must be in just the right order for the molecules to work as they are supposed to.

Quote:

What *is* life, after all? We might be no more than complex flesh robots, our sentience and consciousness merely the aggregate of electrical patterns traversing our complex neural networks.

you gave the answer. consciousness differs live from non-live.

Quote:

In biochemistry, it has already been established that self-replicating molecules exist. As science continues to explore abiogenesis, I am confident that each year will bring us more and more accurate answers regarding the origin of life.

probability of random chance gives already the answer. so , you wast your time, waiting for such answers.

Quote:

For the record, I am an agnostic Norse pagan and non-theist Buddhist with a strong interest in science. Regarding the god(s) of the Bible, I am atheistic, about 6/7 on the Dawkins scale: "I cannot know for certain but I think God is very improbable, and I live my life on the assumption that he is not there."

i am 100% shure, without God, live is absolutely impossible, and its totally irracional to cogitate live can exist without God.

godlovesyou · 11-04-2007, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by romansh

don't expect logic from the born again

all the best

you are not so wrong. we have a irracional faith. but, as incredible as it might appear, our faith " works " :

For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. 19For it is written:
"I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;
the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate."[c]

20Where is the wise man? Where is the scholar? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? 21For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. 22Jews demand miraculous signs and Greeks look for wisdom, 23but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles, 24but to those whom God has called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. 25For the foolishness of God is wiser than man's wisdom, and the weakness of God is stronger than man's strength.

godlovesyou · 11-04-2007, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WilliamBlue

Quote:

Originally Posted by WiliamBlue;

...I think you need to pick a better fairy-tale

I think we need to be fair to Christianity and other religions. The problem is not so much with the "fairy tale" as the people who interpret it and implement it! For example if we could just live by the last eight or nine commandments .... might be a bit boring; but it would not that bad? If we don't recognize and accept the positives in a religion, how can we argue accurately against it?

I have no problem with people who choose to live by whatever commandments, but when they start trying to force all those commandments on others then I have a big issue. Take for instance the availability of free condoms in Africa to prevent the spread of AIDS, the born again and the Catholics have decided that this is a no-no, so AIDS continues to spread and people suffer for no good reason. So don't tell me these people are harmless because they aren't. There are other examples.

we , evangelical christians, are not against use of condom.
don't forget, i have not forced you ore anyone else to come and post at this thread. so please, don't acuse me to try to convert anyone, or to force my faith to someone else. what you do with my testimony, is entirly your business, i have nothing to do with it.

Quote:

They are not coming here to see the light, they are here to preach and condemn us for not seeing it their way. Sometimes a baseball bat looks awful tempting.

I never expect anything close to logic from B/A people, but I can always hope.

wrong again. we are not God to condemn anyone. we just tell to whom wants to know, our faith. if you do not want to know anything about christianism, please search a other thread to spend your time.

godlovesyou · 11-04-2007, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by El_Mariachi64

Quote:

Originally Posted by godlovesyou

I intend to respect anyone's convictions here, and expect the same of you.

So let me make my first question. Why are you agnostic, depite all informations we have access today, to get answers and give the ability to come to a own faith , even if it is atheist faith ?

okay, so plenty of people have answered why they cannot believe as you do.

But let me ask you, why are you born again christian?

More specifically, why aren't you a regular baptist, catholic or calvinist?

i am a regular evangelical christian. i take the command of our lord serious, and tell others with great joy the blessing i have recieved, becoming a christian, and believing in the gospel. please don't accuse me to try to convert someone. that's not my goal. each one has to convert by its own. this decision process is personal, i do not have anything to do with it, and i do not intend to force someone to do it.

godlovesyou · 11-04-2007, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by romansh

godlovesyou: exactly why did you join this forum and what did you expect or (hope) to happen? I'm asking you to look deep inside your feelings and to answer very, very honestly?

i am following the commandment of christ : go all over the world and preach the gospel. i do it literally : i use the world wide web.

romansh · 11-04-2007, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by godlovesyou

i am following the commandment of christ : go all over the world and preach the gospel. i do it literally : i use the world wide web.

I see you are going through the posts ....thanks